作者 主题: 【翻译】在pf2里osr  (阅读 527 次)

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离线 leofor

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【翻译】在pf2里osr
« 于: 2023-01-12, 周四 15:03:17 »
翻译自红迪,先施工中着 :em021
前言
不知道你怎么看,但我非常喜欢PF2的职业,战斗和动作经济,以及它的总体设计。我用这个规则带了多年的团,这很棒。然而,在玩过一些这些史诗般的战役(英雄是真正强大的英雄)之后,我们想尝试一个真实的、OSR 风格的战役。
劇透 -   :
I don't know about you, but I absolutely love PF2's classes, combat and action economy, and its general design. I have run a few multi-year campaigns now with the system and it's been great. However, after playing a number of these epic campaigns (where the heroes are true powerful heroes), we wanted to try a gritty, OSR-style campaign.
我当了 20 多年gm了,真的很享受这想法所带来的挑战。如你所知,PF2 通常不太适合这种类型的游戏。它最适合高魔的、史诗般的超级英雄风格的游戏。然而,我的伙伴们坚持要使用他们熟悉和喜爱的系统来游玩,所以作为gm,我不得不做一些修改。我希望分享我所做的事情,帮到其他相同情况的人。
劇透 -   :
I've been a GM for over 20 years and really enjoyed the challenge this presented. As you may know, PF2 is not typically well-suited to this type of game. It is designed best for high-fantasy, epic super-hero style games. My group, however, insisted on sticking with the system they know and love, so as a GM, I had to make some modifications. I hope to share what I had done in case others find themselves in a similar situation.

生成故事Story Generation
这些雇佣兵式的OSR游戏有一个很大的不同,那就是故事更小,没有那么史诗,但更个人化。我用来支持这一点的一个工具是Mythic GM Emulator(一个solo rpg用的工具,这是他的网址https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/20798/Mythic-Game-Master-Emulator),对于任何规则,任何GM,我都会推荐它。它有一个Foundry模块,使用起来非常容易。有了故事和NPC列表以及令人敬畏的混沌因素,它让我们的游戏和故事在桌面上更好地发展。对于像我这样经验丰富的GM来说,没有什么比不知道接下来会发生什么更有趣的了。
劇透 -   :
A big difference in these mercenary-style, OSR games is the stories are smaller, less epic, but far more personal. One tool I use to support this, and would really recommend to any GM, for any game, is the Mythic GM Emulator. There is a Foundry module for it that makes using quite easy to use. With the story and NPC lists and the awesome Chaos factor, it allows our game and story to evolve organically at the table. Nothing is more fun for an experienced GM like me as not having any idea what is coming next.
举个例子,前几次团期,我的一位玩家派遣他的年轻、鲁莽的雇佣兵到城里找工作。我问了Oracle(应该是软件的功能),他找到了一个人,并在一个随机生成的被称为“神圣深渊”的古老矿井里找到了一份工作(多亏了Ironuard的随机表)。在团间,我对这个地方进行了一些填充,向Oracle询问了一些有关它的问题。由于它被称为神圣深渊,我认为这里有一些宗教意义,以及什么别的意义。在他们到达那里之前(我甚至还不知道他们是否会选择去那里),我已经对这个地方有了基本的设计和地图。当他们到达那里时,我又开始使用Oracle,随着更多的问题给出答案,我知道该这里放置些什么,以及谁真正住在那里。
劇透 -   :
For instance, a few sessions ago, one of my players sent his young, brash mercenary to search for a job in the city. I asked the Oracle, and he found someone and procured a job to an ancient mine that was randomly called the Sacred Abyss (thanks to Ironsworn's tables). Between sessions, I fleshed the place outa bit, asking the Oracle questions about it. Since it was called the Sacred Abyss I assume there was some religious significance, etc. Before they got there (before I even knew if they would choose to go there), I had a basic design and map of the place. When they got there, I started using the oracle again, and as more questions gave answers, I knew what to put in the place and who actually resided there.
偶然的相遇通过场景切换和逻辑有组织地发生,这有助于将事情联系在一起,创造出意想不到的意义。这是Gonzo之间的完美平衡(这句没看懂),任何事情由随机表决定,并有一个有意义的、逻辑性的故事进程,将角色、NPC和事件在展开时联系起来。
劇透 -   :
Random encounters happened organically via Scene Interruptions and logic helped to tie things together and create unintended meaning. It's the perfect balance between Gonzo, anything-goes by rolling on random tables with a meaningful, logical story progression that connects the characters, NPCs, and events as they unfold.

去掉等级熟练Proficiency Without Level
我不是说一定要用这个变体,但它确实让世界感觉更加真实,即使PF2的数值体系不会因此有根本改变。这让我可以更容易地使用随机遭遇表来放置一些致命的怪物。它剥夺了平衡的预先计划的遭遇的“安全性”。然后就由玩家来决定是否有任何遭遇值得一试了。有了这一变体,一个+4级的生物可以被玩家击中,但它依旧拥有巨大的生命值并造成巨大的伤害。此变体支持使用一些“摇摆”OSR风格的遭遇表(我不懂这是什么东西)。这个变体也会影响下一点,即经验。使用此变体,1级角色可以与比其高几级的角色一起玩,而不会觉得无用。他们只是真的要小心自己的HP。
劇透 -   :
This variant rule isn't strictly required, but it really does make the world feel grittier, even though the PF2 math remains solid and doesn't fundamentally change. But this does allow me to more easily use my random encounter tables to spring somewhat deadly monsters. It takes away the 'safety' of balanced pre-planned encounters. Then it is up to the party to decide if any encounter is worth taking on. With PWL, a creature that's LV+4 can still be hit, but it has massive HP and deals massive damage. This variant supports using some 'swingy' OSR-style encounter tables. This variant also feeds into the next points, concerning XP. With this variant, Level 1 characters can hang out with characters a few levels above them and not feel useless. They just really have to be careful about their HP.

经验值Experience Points
为了更好地贴近更真实的OSR风格,您需要改变XP的分发方式。我使用GMG 4-18中的XP图表来计算怪物的总数,然后在分发之前将其除以角色数。这大大减缓了升级进度,减少了击败怪物时获得的xp。XP应该奖励你希望角色专注的东西。在这种情况下,完成任务/任务的XP奖励在我的游戏中要高得多,所以我的玩家更专注于这些。我鼓励他们建立故事并完成故事线。如果你想要一个更传统的OSR风格,根据他们找到并带回家的黄金数量给予XP。
劇透 -   :
To better capture the grittier OSR-style, you need to change how XP is handed out. I use the XP chart from GMG 4-18 to calculate totals for monsters, then divide that by the number of characters before handing it out. This greatly slows progression and reduces the XP from defeating monsters. XP should reward what you want the characters to focus on. In this case, XP rewards from completing quests / jobs are far greater in my game, and so my players are focusing more on these. I'm encouraging them to build story and resolve story threads. If you want a more traditional OSR-style, reward XP based on the amount of gold they find and bring home.

XP的第二个变化是提高需求。OSR游戏的升级速度要慢得多。因此,我建议将升级到下一级别所需的XP设置为1000*当前级别。因此,第2级为1000 XP,第3级为2000 XP,等等,或者选择一些类似的方案来减缓进程。
劇透 -   :
The second change to XP is leveling up requirements. OSR games level up much slower. Therefore I'd suggest making XP required for the next level equal to 1000 x current level. So, 1000 XP for level 2, 2000 XP for level 3, etc. Or some similar scheme that slows progression.

我们已经游玩了很多高级别的PF2,所以我的玩家实际上更希望在这段时间里游玩低级别的游戏。我的玩家最喜欢的团是我们的PF2测试战役,这个团持续了近2年,最终他们也只达到了5级。只需确保设定期望值,并确保你的玩家了解你正在运行的游玩风格。

劇透 -   :
We've played a bunch of high-level PF2, so my players actually are eager to play low-levels for longer periods this time around. My players favorite campaign was our PF2 playtest campaign that lasted almost 2 years in which they reached Level 5 at the end. Just be sure to set expectations and that your players understand the type of game you are running.

受伤与伤残Wounds and Injuries
我希望伤口和死亡变得更加残酷和真实。不是说要像OSR游戏中0hp就死了,而是为这些失败的尝试添加了故事元素。伤病系统非常适合这一点,因为我喜欢玩家对他们在前一次遭遇中受伤的腿的扮演(例如,在《我,我自己,骰!》的整个第二季中,阿恩·卡拉蓬基)。
劇透 -   :
I wanted wounds and death to be something far more darker and grittier. Not quite the 0 hp and your dead of the OSR games, but something that adds a story element to these failures. An injury system is perfect for this, as I love when players can role-play that old maimed leg from a previous encounter in their life (e.g. Arne Kalapunki in the entire second season of Me, Myself, and Die!).

我真的很喜欢狂野世界的伤残系统,所以我修改了这个概念并在PF2使用他。你可以在这篇文章的末尾找到规则。这使得玩家真的想要像真人一样避免战斗。但当不可避免的时候,他们需要用最好的团队合作来确保没有人倒下。(他们也没有牧师,所以这是另一个问题,但也是我们低魔法设定的一部分,Enelis世界(某个世设))。
劇透 -   :
I really loved Savage Worlds injury system and so I modified the concept to work with PF2. You can find the rules at the end of this post. This makes the players really want to avoid combat like a real person would. But when it is inevitable, they are using their best teamwork to ensure that no one goes down. (They also don't have a cleric, so that's another problem, but also part of our low magic setting, the World of Enelis).

在这方面,生命值起着耐力的作用。它代表着精力和努力,以及瘀伤和小伤口的累积。受伤的情况和伤害是对身体的真正伤害。这些是持久的,不容易治愈。这使角色真正成为凡人,而不是超级英雄。
劇透 -   :
In this regard, HP functions as Stamina. It represents energy and exertion and the cumulation of bruises and small cuts. The Wounded condition and injuries are real wounds to the body. These last and are not easily healed. This makes the characters truly mortals and not super-heroes.

旅行规则Journey Rules
我直接使用了Forbidden Lands(可能是另一款trpg)的旅行规则。这是一个很棒的系统,感觉很现实,但不会变得太crunchy(不知道怎么翻译合适)。我还加入了指环王(估计是说对应的trpg规则)中旅途中角色职务的点子。我们单独追踪每个人的火把和灯油,但使用的是基于团队的口粮和饮用水系统,它们将受限于基本逻辑和重量限制。团队资源模块在这里非常有用。如果你想要我使用的修改规则,请告诉我。
劇透 -   :
I am straight-up using the journey rules from Forbidden Lands. It's a fabulous system and feels realistic without getting too crunchy. I also threw in the idea of journey roles from The One Ring. We are tracking torches and lamp oil individually, but are using a party-based Ration and Water system limited by basic logic and weight limits. The Party Resources module really helps out here. If you want the modified rules I use, DM me.
这个系统使离开舒适的居住地和探索荒野变得有意义。到目前为止,这是OSR荒野六角爬行游戏的一个伟大的现代实现。
劇透 -   :
This system makes leaving the comforts of a settlement and the exploration of the wilderness meaningful. It is by far a great modern implementation of the OSR wilderness hex-crawl game.

宝藏Treasure
忽略PHB的物品-级别表。让宝物变得有意义、难以获得、且随机。也许他们在过去两个团期中一直在推进的地牢已经被洗劫过了(问问Oracle吧!)。也许是运气好,他们在荒野中发现了一小堆硬币。
劇透 -   :
Ignore the treasure by level charts of the PHB. Make treasure meaningful, hard to acquire, and appreciatively random. Perhaps the dungeon they've been pushing through for the past two sessions has already been raided (ask the Oracle!). Perhaps through shear luck they find a small cache of coins buried in the wilderness.

让财富的积累成为角色可以向往的东西,但不要让它变得容易。低级角色应该为财富和生存而奋斗。他们了选择一个高风险的职业,但可能不会得到回报。如果角色具备技能,“休整/制作”规则实际上应该是一种吸引人的赚钱方式。冒险本质上是在用自己的生命来赌博,应该会有这种感觉。巨大的回报很少,但一旦发生,他们应该会感到由衷的满足。
劇透 -   :
Make the accumulation of wealth something that characters can aspire towards, but don't make it easy. Low-level characters should struggle for wealth and survival. They are actively choosing a risky and dangerous profession that may not pay-out. The Downtime/Crafting rules should actually seem an attractive means to earn money if the characters have the skills. Adventuring is essentially gambling with one's life, and it should feel like it. The big pay-outs are few and far between, but when they happen, they should feel satisfying.

同时,我们在一个相对较低的魔法环境中玩,所以魔法物品对我们来说很重要。每个魔法物品都很特别,它们都有一个名字(世界特定的)和传说。坦率地说,无论设定如何,你都应该这样做,每一个魔法物品都应该看起来特别,即使它是一个普通的+1个长剑。这是一个建立世界设定的好抓手。
劇透 -   :
We also play in a relatively low-magic setting, so magic items are a big deal for us. Every magic item is special, they have a name (world-specific) and lore attached to them. Frankly, you should do this regardless of the setting, every magic item should always seem special, even if its a run-of-the-mill +1 longsword. It's a great place to build world lore.

示例:“这把剑是为诺曼人入侵和屠杀托尔丹地区而制造的。”所以,现在当这个角色遇到托尔丹遗族时,这些人会认为角色是混蛋,才会使用这把武器。
劇透 -   :
Example: "This sword was crafted for the Noman invasion and massacre of the Toldan region." So, now when that character encounters Toldan-heritage people they think he's a bastard for using it.

.
我希望这篇文章对那些想把PF2巧妙地融入到一个更真实的OSR风格游戏中的人有所帮助。如果你有任何问题,请告诉我。纯美苹果园干杯!
劇透 -   :
I hope this post is helpful to anyone else looking to paradoxically squeeze PF2 into a grittier OSR-style game. Let me know if you have any questions. Cheers!
附录
--伤残规则Injury Rules--

受伤与伤残Wounds and Injury
受伤如标准规则作用。然而,每当角色获得受伤时,他们必须进行DC 10强韧豁免(使用无等级熟练规则)。在此鼓励使用英雄点数。
劇透 -   :
Wounded condition works as normal. However, whenever a character receives the Wounded condition they must make a DC 10 Fortitude save (using PWL rules). Encourage the use of Hero Points here.

大失败:立即死亡
失败:永久伤残
成功:临时伤残
大成功:不受伤残

劇透 -   :
Critical Failure: Immediate death.
Failure: Permanent Injury
Success: Temporary Injury
Critical Success: No injury.

受伤的情况代表需要愈合和修补的伤口,越少恶化。伤残是由于这些伤口造成的长期虚弱。
劇透 -   :
The Wounded condition represents active wounds that need to be healed and patched up less they get worse. Injuries represent long-term debilitations due to those wounds taken.

伤残表Injury Table:
投掷2d6,并在伤残表中查找对应的临时或永久性伤残
劇透 -   :
Roll 2d6 on the injury table to see your temporary or permanent injury.

伤残表Injury Table

2 = 不可忽视的创伤Unmentionables: . 在所有检定和dc上-1

3 - 4 = 手臂Arm:如果手臂伤残了,那么就不能使用那只手进行任何需要手臂的动作.

5 - 9 = 身体Body: 骰1d6

. . . . 1 - 2 = 骨裂Broken Bone: 在基于敏捷的dc和检定中-1

. . . . 3 - 4 = 残躯Battered Body: 在所有基于体质的检定和dc中-1,并且减少等于角色等级的最大生命值(如同流失)

. . . . 5 - 6 = 青肿Bruised Body: 在所有基于力量的检定和dc中-1-1 (如图力竭)

10 - 11 = 腿Leg: 一条腿受伤,-10基础速度。

12 =头 Head: 骰1d6

. . . . 1 - 2 = 疮疤Hideous Scar: 所有基于魅力的检定和dc-1

. . . . 3 - 4 = 盲目Blinded Eye: 察觉和先攻-2

. . . . 5 - 6 = 脑损伤Brain Damage: 所有基于智力和感知的检定和dc-1(如同呆滞)

治疗伤残Healing Injuries
伤残无法被治疗法术治疗。只有再生可以恢复伤残。(记住,治疗法术可以恢复生命值,从而恢复人的体力和精神。)
劇透 -   :
Injuries cannot be healed with the Heal spell. Only Regeneration can mend an injury. (Remember Heal restores HP, thus minor cuts and bruises, it restores a person's stamina and spirit.)
每天一次,当一个角色休息四分之一天时,他们可以尝试DC 15强韧豁免,以从临时伤残中恢复。如果他们花了一整天的时间来恢复,他们可能会在豁免检定增加+2加成。
劇透 -   :
Once per day, when a character takes a REST for a Quarter-Day, they may attempt a DC 15 Fortitude save to recover from a temporary injury. If they instead take a full day to recover, they may add a +2 bonus to the roll.

照顾伤残:
另一个角色可以在这段时间内(四分之一天或全天)照顾受伤的角色,成功通过DC 18医疗检定将为豁免提供+2加成,或在大成功时提供+4。
劇透 -   :
TREATING INJURIES: Another character can attend to the injured character during the time period (Quarter-Day or full day), with a successful DC 18 Medicine check providing a +2 bonus to the save, or a +4 with a critical success.
« 上次编辑: 2023-01-13, 周五 11:45:06 由 leofor »
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离线 Xtoril

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Re: 【翻译】在pf2里osr
« 回帖 #1 于: 2023-01-12, 周四 18:53:53 »
一篇真正的Mythic GM Emulator安麗文章(
不過這篇文章的設計本身就像作者說的,他們玩膩了原本的設計
而且喜歡計算有意義的團隊資源還有隨機性
只能說一切出自於他的20年GM經驗,才能把所謂隨機表的意外性與其他設計層層相接
一般開團還是先看看玩家意願安定
向Oracle討點子這點或許可以用問寫作AI來代替
魔法物品的設定這點只能說是個人風格問題,畢竟再怎麼設計,數據上都是一樣的東西,差距不過是有沒有用心塑造
一定程度上這些非效果的風味文字也可能導致玩家對物品產生誤會,當然,這種事情本身也是趣味的一環
減緩等級提升速度....嗯,或許對玩膩了高等級角色的玩家來說,逗留在那種手段有限,需要多花費心思的低等期間多一些時間也有不少樂趣
當然,聽著確實很有吸引力,戰後恢復和傷殘讓玩家不能魯莽行事,也增強體質的存在
使用去除等級熟練可選規則讓等級不再具有絕對壓倒性,的確也讓戰鬥變得更危險
但說實在的,他說的有些太過美好,彷彿低等角色和高等角色就差HP罷了

离线 leofor

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Re: 【翻译】在pf2里osr
« 回帖 #2 于: 2023-01-13, 周五 08:56:29 »
一篇真正的Mythic GM Emulator安麗文章(
不過這篇文章的設計本身就像作者說的,他們玩膩了原本的設計
而且喜歡計算有意義的團隊資源還有隨機性
只能說一切出自於他的20年GM經驗,才能把所謂隨機表的意外性與其他設計層層相接
一般開團還是先看看玩家意願安定
向Oracle討點子這點或許可以用問寫作AI來代替
魔法物品的設定這點只能說是個人風格問題,畢竟再怎麼設計,數據上都是一樣的東西,差距不過是有沒有用心塑造
一定程度上這些非效果的風味文字也可能導致玩家對物品產生誤會,當然,這種事情本身也是趣味的一環
減緩等級提升速度....嗯,或許對玩膩了高等級角色的玩家來說,逗留在那種手段有限,需要多花費心思的低等期間多一些時間也有不少樂趣
當然,聽著確實很有吸引力,戰後恢復和傷殘讓玩家不能魯莽行事,也增強體質的存在
使用去除等級熟練可選規則讓等級不再具有絕對壓倒性,的確也讓戰鬥變得更危險
但說實在的,他說的有些太過美好,彷彿低等角色和高等角色就差HP罷了
实际上体验这些有其他更好的规则可以来完成,但是他与他的玩家更喜欢pf2.
无施法者+菜刀+喜欢低等级,pf2还是做得相对好一些,当然即使是菜刀,低等级能排序的动作也更少,必须应当认识到,在他运作的游戏中,战斗外或许才是最为至关重要的。只是即使是我,我读这篇文章的时候,也很难一下子反应过来,他带团真正的高明之处在于如何随机应变的安排故事,以及调和pl们。
总的来说我认为他可能是一个很厉害的dm,但是这个规则转换本身,并无太多出彩,反而是只言片语之间透露出不少“正确的废话”,比如给每个武器设计一个背景——大家都知道,但是大家都很难做到。
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离线 Caelum

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Re: 【翻译】在pf2里osr
« 回帖 #3 于: 2023-01-13, 周五 10:32:39 »
引用
《我,我自己》和《死亡!》

Me, Myself and Die 是一个标题啦。大概就是翻成《我,自己,与骰》之类的


离线 leofor

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Re: 【翻译】在pf2里osr
« 回帖 #4 于: 2023-01-13, 周五 11:44:16 »
引用
《我,我自己》和《死亡!》

Me, Myself and Die 是一个标题啦。大概就是翻成《我,自己,与骰》之类的
这里机翻捏,因为翻译这种帖子我想偷懒,这就改这就改!
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